Fransk familie i Norge...

[trambouze]

Kjære norske Sjøfolk ! Dear Norwegian sailors ! 

 

We are sorry, we can only write in English now, not yet in Norwegian (one of us speaks en lille smule Danish though...)

 

The thing is that we want to come to Norway, buy a wooden boat and stay there.

So our aim is to find a boat quite big (15+ metres, sailing or a trawler) for a symbolic price and a beautiful restoration to do. 

We have non-profit association experience in restoration.

The boat would a be a place to live and to work, and a social place : because we want to create an art gallery aboard. 

We are open to all discussions and all ideas, ask us questions.

We saw several annonses at www.finn.no , but we know that many things do not appear at web-sites, and as we are not in Norway yet to ask questions to everybody, we want discover the life of the forum !

 

Thanks to everyone and HALLO !

 

Arnaud and Elena and Rose 

[Framtia]

Welcome :-). I think you will find this forum of great assistance. Note that there is vast amounts of info here already, but surely it will be difficult to perform searches in Norwegian. We have e.g. a thread where one can ask for assistance in looking at boats for sale. There are also threads with discussions about suitable boats for living, good harbours etc. (I assume you have a web browser which  can translate text automatically?).  

 

Where in Norway do you plan to live?

Redigert 12.November.2015 av Framtia (see edit history)

[trambouze]

Hi Framtia, thanks for answering ! 

We have already lived aboard, so no problem with that !

For instance, we have seen quite a lot of boats near Bergen. And especially we REALLY like the shape of the "canoe-stern" Norwegian boats. (We are more used to English wooden classics "plank-on-edge").

We like this boat :

http://www.finn.no/finn/boat/used/object?finnkode=66354369

But we would want bigger. 

And we have an intention to rig such boat with time.

It may be a long research, but are totally free to go anywhere in Norway, even to the Arctic regions !

Thanks again

[Rolf]

Welcome to the very best norwegian boating forum!

You seems to have done a lot of groundwork already so you probably already know that for skippering a boat at 15m or longer, you are required to hold a coastal skipper certificate. 

Should you not already hold such a certificate you can read more about it here http://baatskolen.no/pages/english-summary.php

 

Good luck in finding the perfect boat.

[trambouze]

Thank You Roft for you Welcome and your information 

We have Capitaine 1000 certificate (for boats up to 1000 hp motors) in France. For sailing boats of all sizes - no need of certificate for French citizens.

And even if we are abroad, the legislation about certificates is defined by the Captain's nationality !

[Framtia]

You seem to be looking for a boat type called "skøyte" in Norwegian. There are several on Finn: 

http://m.finn.no/boat/forsale/ad.html?finnkode=66090494&class=6921&page=2&ref=fas

http://m.finn.no/boat/forsale/ad.html?finnkode=59130992&page=3&q=sk%C3%B8yte&ref=fas

 

 

Be careful not to buy something which will be a nightmare to keep seaworthy though... 

Redigert 13.November.2015 av Framtia (see edit history)

[trambouze]

Thanks Framtia,

We have contacted the one for 80,000, he has not answered.

And the other one is over our budget : we prefer to restore a boat during two years.

We are orientated more to a restoration, than to a purchase.

[Framtia]

try to call him, there is a lot of scam at finn and many adverticers are sceptic against foreigners...

[trambouze]

We shall get organized to call !

[blue moon]

Hi

 

I might know about a "skøyte" that is for sale, the guy who own`s it, lives in it now and wants to buy an apartment instead.

Its in good shape and looks nice, especially the living room blowed me away :)

Whats your budget by the way? I can get you more info later.

[trambouze]

Thank you, Blue moon!

Our budget will be pushed forward more by the restoration and the equipment, than by the purchase. We prefer to repair, or to save boats. So the more the boat is ancient, with historical sense, the more we shall have motivation to commit ourselves. 

In any case, our budget will depend on this criteria, between 1 and 100 000 NOK we may discuss.

[Popeye70]

Welcome aboard Norways's best boating forum, and welcome to Norway, Trambouze!

 

From the Finn ad you listed, you seem to be interrested in older fishing/freight boats and similar shaped boats. Sadly, many older fishing boats were decommisioned and either sunk or left to rot in the eighties (and nineties?) as the fishermen lost their fishing quotas or realized that their boats could not compete with newer boats with more modern equipment. There are still some left though, so just keep looking. Let Baatplassenand it's members work for you, and you may get offers for boats that are not advertised. 

 

BTW - the reason you want the kind of boat you do, is it based on aestethics, economy or some other factor? What is the budget, and does it matter if it is a wooden or metal boat?

 

Looks like you'll get a lot of boat for the money here: http://www.finn.no/finn/boat/used/object?finnkode=61860940. It isn't quite the boat type you asked for (partly square stern etc), but it has a large freight compartment that could quite easily be rebuilt to fit your requirements. If it is legal to do so without a reclassification of some sort...? I have no idea.

[trambouze]

Thanks, Popeye ! We shall privilege wood - this is the material that we know. And we know that things will to us easier thanks to Baatplassen! We are not in an urgency, just now it is a good moment. 

We have also seen that ad for a 77ft boat, but this is already a finished project, and the budget is too important. 

I think that the most important criteria will be the age of the boat.

And also whether it is rigged or not.

But still, if we find an opportunity, we shall rethink the budget if needed!

But as we say in France : "Whilst there's no buyer, there's no price to a boat" !

You must have a similar expression in Norway ! 

[Tranen2]

Nice boat!

http://www.finn.no/finn/boat/used/object?finnkode=67209299&searchclickthrough=true

[Fiks]

Hello!

 

Concerning the purchase and possible restoration of old commercial vessels to be kept- and used in Norway, you have to consider the following issues:

1. The requirement of a qualified master of the vessel. The master of a pleasure Craft between 15 and 24 m in length is to have a D5L certificate, which is valid for pleasure vessels only. If the vessel is more than 24 m in length, the master is to have a D5 certificate as for Commercial vessels of the same tonnage.
2. Old vessels can have an issue concerning the title to the vessel. The proof of ownerhip and the possibillity to obtain a proper bill of sale  is to be checked before purchase.
3. If the vessel is more than 15 m in length and registered as a commercial vessel, it is illegal to move the vessel without valid certificates or single voyage permit from the Norwegian Maritime Authority.
4. To register an ex. commercial vessel as a pleasure craft requires that the vessel is RCD compliant and can be provided with CE marks. The main problem to be dealt with besides the demand for documentation is the emission requirements from the propulsion engine. Historic vessels might be exempted from RCD requirements and you can contact NMA to clarify this matter if you have some vessels on hand for purchase.
5.  The condition of the old wooden vessel in the price range below NOK 100.000,- will normally be very close to wreck and if the vessel does not have a considerable historic value the cost of restoration can normally not be defended. (You can have the boat free and still have encounter huge problems to finish the project at a reasonable cost in own manpower and money.
6.  To perform an extensive restoration project (and also to have a safe place to moor the vessel) you need to have access to a wharf with decent access, and a workshop suited for woodworking. You will also need to hire a proper slipway for some time to perform works on the underwater parts of the vessel.

Redigert 13.November.2015 av Fiks (see edit history)

[trambouze]

Hi Fiks! Thanks so much for such precious remarks, especially concerning Norwegian legislation ! (And more : in Elnglish! It will make us win time).

We have some experience in wooden boat restoration and good friends ship-builders (carpenters), whose pleasure will be to assist us in this adventure.

 

Also, we will most probably hold the Norwegian flag on a Norwegian old boat - it does not seem logical to us to "Francize" it.

[trambouze]

Thanks Tranen ! Right, this annons is recent; we are looking at...

(It's really cool the forum is so active )

Nice boat!

http://www.finn.no/finn/boat/used/object?finnkode=67209299&searchclickthrough=true

[småbåtentusiasten]

Regarding parts and tools for the boat: Have you taken into account how expensive everything in Norway is, especially concerning boats?

[Fiks]

Looks like you'll get a lot of boat for the money here: http://www.finn.no/finn/boat/used/object?finnkode=61860940. It isn't quite the boat type you asked for (partly square stern etc), but it has a large freight compartment that could quite easily be rebuilt to fit your requirements. If it is legal to do so without a reclassification of some sort...? I have no idea.

 

 I have built a model of that vessel. The model was purchased by the children of the previous owner to be given to him as present at his 70th anniversary.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The vessel has been rebuilt several times in the in the period from 1962 to 1976. It was built as a steam powered tug Holland in 1915, lengthenes and converted to a general cargo vessel with semi diesel engine in 1962 and over the following years it was provided with new superstructure, new raised main deck and a complete replacement of all original hull structures, Maybe the the teak wheelhouse doors can be the original ones.

The picture of the vessel below is from 1968 after the bow part was renewed.

 

Redigert 14.November.2015 av Fiks (see edit history)

[Framtia]

Flott, hvordan gjør man slikt egentlig? 

[trambouze]

Hello, yes, we know that Norway is a quite expensive country. As well as Danemark.

We have already made some budget estimation for the yacht Artemis in Hamburg and the estimations have been twice as high as in France. 

In France we know alternative systems - for example, associations of heritage, who make very interesting prices, we do not know yet whether it exists in Norway...

 

The ship model is superb, Fiks ! As soon as we have signed, we shall make an order !

 

Regarding parts and tools for the boat: Have you taken into account how expensive everything in Norway is, especially concerning boats?

[Fiks]

Flott, hvordan gjør man slikt egentlig? 

(Translation: Nice, how do one actually do this?)

 

With patience

 

Maybe a bit "off topic" but actually the building process for this model  is as follows:

 

As there is no actual construction drawing of the vessel, the hull shape and arragement details was mesured on board. For the first two models, one made in 1981 and one made in 1988 all parts was made with hand tools. All measurements was transferred from sketches and scribed diredtly on the plywood sheets used for ribs and superstructure etc. In order to save the information about the previous models, I made AutoCad drawings of the General Arrangement plan and the Lines plan. When I was asked to make the model above I decided to make proper drawings of all the parts and have all plywood  laser cut by a modelling company.

 

The Plank On Bulkhead method was used for the model, and  the bulheads, keel and stringers was made from 4 mm birch plywwod. Bulwarks, superstructure and decks was made from 1,5 mm plywood and small details from 1,0 mm plywood.  The whull was planked with 8x1,5 mm mahogany strips, glued to the bulkheads. The railings, masts and derrics are made of brass tubes and rods. Most of the small fittings like lanterns, blocks anchors etc. are standard parts purchased from modelling shops.

 

Profile drawing

 

 

Sections

 

Cutting files

 

 

Laser cut plywood sheet

 

Dry assembly of laser cut bulkheads

 

Planking with mahogany strips

 

Glass cloth and polyester coating

 

 

Superstructure with outfitting

 

 

Painting of small parts

Redigert 14.November.2015 av Fiks (see edit history)

[trambouze]

Yes, Fjordgrynt, I am serious.

But it is always case-by-case, which is the main difference between dream and reality.

Questions of organization and logistics are the ones who define investments.

I lack information concerning the administration system in Norway, but I am working over it.

 

Concerning the members of our family, each one has different type of courage, but which are not incompatible. 

[Grønnskollingen]

Ignore fjordgrynt, trambouze. He is the forums resident troll and have a hard time keeping the personal insults at bay.

[Framtia]

Fiks: impressive!

Trambouze: there is an "ignore" function on the forum...:-)

Redigert 14.November.2015 av Framtia (see edit history)